Ep 499: Developement In Phoenix With Jared Vidales

Transcript

hello welcome to the hod podcast I'm your host Daniel Martinez today we have a special guest Jared the Dallas out of

Phoenix

Arizona how you doing today I am doing fantastic how you doing I'm doing all

right I'm doing all right I have an interesting story with you and uh we actually met in Phoenix a couple weeks ago that I really wanted to bring up

early on just because it kind of adds to like our lineage tree of how we learned real estate but I can't wanted to cover

this so I I took a course me and Anthony if everybody doesn't know we took a course and that's how we met was from

Jaylen white and I we met Jared in town in Phoenix and he's like oh I know

Jaylen we're actually I we actually were we actually got in real estate at the same time you want to tell us how that

iteration happened because I think this is like another iteration of the of the real estate treat for us so I really want to cover this first yeah no this

was this was before there were gurus you know this is especially before Arizona

became such a hot bed for you know Real Estate Investors competition I would say

Arizona is probably the most competitive market in the United States but I mean we I started back in 20 2014 and it

actually came about where I rented a crappy little office well I guess let's take a step back so I was in the corporate world did that for about two

and a half years as an engineer I quit to go out and do real estate I'm originally from California I moved to

Arizona for my for my corporate job and you know I've always been interested in

real estate but long story short I quit my job it wasn't for me and decided to

go out and flip homes because that's what everybody wants to do they want to go flip homes but first I had to find the deal

right so anyways I I end up flipping two homes find out you know because I bought these homes from wholesalers I bought

two in the same day to go out and flip I had a bunch of Bitcoin money and that's that's what financed my uh my

Renovations I was an early adopter in Bitcoin but I when I bought these two homes I saw this wholesaler made 20 25

Grand a pop and I had no idea what what an assignment fee was anyways I flipped those homes it takes way too long costs

way too much money and I make like 25 Grand but I'm looking back at that a wholesaler and I'm like holy crap you

made the same amount of money as me no risk no headache no no gray hairs I need to go out and learn how to how to do

this so that's exactly what I did I rented a crappy little office in the hood and just started printing letters

like all night stuffing sing and I posted something on Instagram and

this this dude was following me his name was Carlos Reyes and he's like hey man I saw your doing real estate like I want

to let me come to your office and kind of see what you're doing so he comes to my office in the hood and he's like dude

this is this is cool like let's joint venture on a on a direct mail campaign we we'll mail them to Hispanic folks

I'll be I'll be the uh Hispanic guy you be the white money partner even though I'm not white and we'll play that we'll

play that Dynamic I'm like great you buy the St camps I'll print everything and then I'll get some people off Craigslist

to to come here and stuff everything and hired a bunch of crackheads and it was it was bad like I was 20 22 years old so

we we go out and tie up like three or four deals and make like a 100 Grand on this one campaign he's like dude this is

it I'm gonna like and you know he's like I'm gonna quit my job blah blah blah and so uh I think jayen was on social media

as well Jaylen and Alex signs and they kind of got in at the same time

and I remember I dropped Alex signs off he he came and rode with me to my flips

and he's like hey my my buddy Jaylen white wants to uh wants to get into this too we went to the same high school

together I'm like cool bring him out like more the marrier and so like us us four were kind of running running deals

together you know joint venturing helping people close out or lock up deals and you know it's so funny because

you know everybody kind of went off and did their own thing and became extremely successful but that's that's how all

four of us kind of got out of the the corporate or you know kind of the N9 to-5 and jumped into real estate

completely out risk and we just made it happen and we really made it happen because we we the most important thing

and this is what's unique about the Arizona Market is everybody is open to collaborating because back then like I

said there was no gurus so when we found something that worked we would call everybody and we'd be all excited like

hey this is hitting right now and then we all go out and do it and then all of a sudden it would die down and then

somebody would find something else that was new it's like hey guys this is hitting and we would just share like our

our our secrets on how we're getting deals and that's kind of how in my opinion that's how the real estate

residential side evolved which is very unique to other markets yeah and one thing you said too

is uh who Who's the who said who's the who's the little Godfather of that sound I can't remember his name uh Sean

Shan Terry we that was the only Guru back then with sha Terry wow yeah he's

good I mean he he really you know he's not one of those guys who keeps everything close to chest like when I

was going to his office back in like 2014 2015 like he would just lay it all out like guys this is this is how you do

it and that's that was that was perfect I mean that really helped all of us yeah

and so you've been doing this a very very long time you're kind of you kind

of took took a lot of front-end risk how how so you're were 22 when you started

how long you been doing this now I've been doing this since 2014

so going yeah going on 10 years wow decade I'm one of them old I'm one of

them old man can't you can't see the gray hairs here yet but if you're in real estate long enough you'll start getting

them yeah I got I got a few I got a few no A decade is a long time it's it's

really interesting to kind of it's uh you have like those groundbreaking stories that of early on of the struggle

at 22 and doing all this crazy stuff and bit signs like those stories are amazing but like 10 years later it's

like what happened what's changed what's new you know and you kind of like

remembering where you came from is really it's really cool part of the story you know oh yeah and back then you

know it's kind of like being in high school no responsibilities you know you're kind of

running around hanging out you know it's like you know you don't have the burden of all this risk on your shoulders like

how we do now because now we're doing very you know large deals and there's real money on the line but back then it

was just like you know tinkering around figuring out what works and now those those were the fun days yeah so let's

talk a little bit about what you're doing now because I think now I think we had a great conversation we had we had

we met for dinner and we had a great conversation but what you're doing now is pretty crazy I do want to preface this though

you made a tweet an hour ago or so about how you're talking to OG land guy he

tell us a little about that story because that's a very intriguing story to me and I want to hear more about that yeah so I sent a little mail campaign

to people in Arizona who were lending private so I'm trying to find I'm trying to add more private lenders to my

Rolodex and this guy calls me he's like hey jar got your letter you know very thought out uh just come to my office uh so as was down there

this morning he's probably mid 70s he's he's a third he's a third generation

arizonian and his great-grandfather I think he was like the one like a senator

here but anyways he has very deep lineage uh here in Arizona and uh so he was just we're we're sharing War Stories

you know how it goes and it's just so much fun sharing those things and he's like yeah there's this one you know back

then Glendale Road and for your listeners who don't who don't know Glendale Road or Bethany Home Road is

like that's like core core Phoenix like that's like Prime area it's like back then everything north of Bethany Home

Road was completely vacant land and I used to own a live there's one McDonald's here and Arizona is like the

third or fourth fastest growing city in the US like it's I mean the population

here is insane so say there's one McDonald's is shows how far back he's he's been here so and he's he's like I I

had a commercial building here and there and blah blah blah and then one guy you know he's a broker he's like one time

this this guy he showed up he's like hey you know this group there's gonna be this new city that's going to be

incorporated into you know Maricopa County it's called Paradise Valley and

it's GNA be the next thing and like you should you should buy you should buy some acreage for 50 bucks and the guy's

like dude 50 bucks like there's no roads there's no no freaking way am I G to buy

in A Place Called Paradise Valley fast forward to today Acres there are selling for $2.5 million just the dirt and I'm

like dude that just that just goes to show you like

anyways don't I I wanted to show A visual representation of where this is

so Paradise Valley is north of Tempe and if I zoom in

it is builds out yeah exactly they're all one acre lots this is I live in

Paradise Valley and it's a very I mean it's it's the it's the most expensive

zip code in Arizona they're not allowed to have street lights there there's not allow no commercial there is allowed no

retail no nothing it's just one acre lots no street lights no um no curbs

like very rural but like I mean there's homes in there selling for30 million bucks brand new it's insane that's crazy

that's crazy it's so $2 and a half million dollars per acre is insane per acre per acre it is that is

insane that is insane so for everybody for everybody here that doesn't want to invest in land I think if you're in the

path of progress you can hold on to land long enough and you're going to do very very well especially an up markets like

this I saw a video of recently on Twitter and I wish I could find that I wish have thought about it before this

call but it showed like the expansion of Phoenix over like the last like 50 years

and it's literally insane because it was just a desert town and then what it is now is it's literally insane so yeah

it's it's bananas like we have so much so many headquarters moving here I mean

I think the statistic is 100,000 people move here a year I mean it's nothing nothing like Texas but Texas is so much

bigger than Arizona but it's just an exploding Market getting a lot of

Californians coming over unfortunately but yeah I'm very bullish Arizona so one

thing I and this is this is a very developer question for me but one thing we're always looking at is water access

what's the water water issue in in Phoenix what what does that what does that look like yeah no I mean there's

this big there's this big conversation around water here obviously and there's

a lot of Articles you know a year ago about how Arizona is going to run out of water

but really what it was is so like we're required to have a 100-year water

plan and we missed during that year we missed that water plan by a half of a

percent so you know what I mean Arizona Mr water plan by a half of a percent and

everybody was you know how the media is everyone was going bananas like oh my God Arizona's going to run out of water

the Colorado River etc etc but it wasn't it wasn't that big of an impact and this

is actually an interesting statistic we use the same amount of water today in

Maricopa County with I think we have five million people here the same amount of water then we did back in

1950 really yep yep when there was a fraction of the

population because we we have Water Reclamation plants that cycle water energy efficient

Plumbing devices all like rainwater capture so we we use same amount of water we did

almost you know 80 years ago 70 years ago you've gotten more you gotten more efficient as that's good that's good

okay that makes sense that's very interesting one thing I love about Phoenix is it's very modern I feel like

they're one of the early they're one of the newer cities that's really adapted and took on

technology and like new new looks like if if anybody's ever been

to Phoenix go to Phoenix it's amazing but Phoenix just looks new like it's

like it's a new modern city in my opinion yeah a lot of uh you know I

wouldn't say we're at the Forefront Forefront of architecture but we're pretty close but you know in a market

that's extremely competitive you got to find especially if you're a builder you got to find a Competitive Edge and the

people find that through architecture yeah yeah so let's jump a little bit

into stuff you're doing now I saw a video of you recently you were it was a

it was it was a it was a I don't know if it was an ad no it wasn't an ad it was you you were building like a condo or

apartments or something and you had like they just put in the water utilities and the stick frames getting built up is

that one of your current projects let's talk a little about that because I think that's that's really really interesting and like what the outlay on that is yeah

so that's a uh 16 Town Home Project it's out in a little not little it's a big

city mes Mesa Arizona it's about 30 seconds from the Oakland a spring

training Stadium like kind of downtown Mesa we the funny thing was was there

was there was a a house on an acre that was just sitting in our Pipeline and it

was there for like four or five years and one of my acquisition persons um you

know finally was able to strike deal with this lady so we paid 220 grand for

essentially two houses on one acre we knew what the underlying zoning was so we knew we knew it was a great deal kind

of during that time we we kind of shift not not shifted our Focus but we wanted

to go out and build we wanted to find tracks of land build with the sole

purpose of gr scaling the portfolio so let's build let's build these brand new

units let's hold on to them for a very very long time and that's how we're going to scale quicker so anyways we you

know and I found at that time I found my mentor who's also a large developer Builder and you know we we made an

agreement he like look Jared if you ever come across land I I'll help you through the entitlement process I'll build it at

this fee structure and you you really don't have to worry but his goal is to

make me a developer which it's it's complicated I'll tell you so anyway we

at that same time like look I got this piece I got this acre in Mesa he's like it's too small go make it bigger so then

I was knocking on all the neighbors doors trying to get them to to sell them or sell me their land to make my site

bigger and I was I was successful with one guy so I added another like half acre to the project so anyways we the

the the site was an assemblage of two Parcels total cost in the land was like

440 Grand it's a good deal it took me like a year and a half to entitle that project took forever didn't have to

rezone it just entitlements took forever and we broke ground about a year year

and some change ago so 16 Town Homes two car garages on the bottom and it's it

will be done middle of this year total build cost is like five million bucks

and then oddly enough the okon a they want to put a Master Lease on the entire project and lease it out to their

players really that is interesting and this that's like the perfect model for you

because you didn't you wanted like in come from it anyway it was a longterm for you so if you can lease it out with

like Step Up raises and stuff like that especially if it's if it's players oh man that's a good that's a good that's a

good little that's crazy yeah well we'll see nothing's done until it's done but that

that seems like the best the best option absolutely no that's amazing I really want to talk about that alone right

there and this is one of the things I love I love land as a whole because it's it's very creative and you can kind of

create whatever you want at the end so you said you bought was that was there a a house on that other Halfacre that you

bought or was it just vacant land no there was there was a house it was like a 1930s House Old Neighborhood it was an

Old Farm Community back in the day and so these houses were like super super

old and I like I like the little pocket because I like putting high density in kind of low density feeling areas

because it's just it just feels more more like a community if you will yeah

yeah so you essentially push over the houses Now You're Building 16 town homes

and this is that's it's so it's so it's so creative I love land because you can kind of create whatever you want with it

and especially with up and cominging part of town like uh Phoenix you kind of do whatever you want as long as you go

through the tlement process and kind of have a vision can you tell us how you met your Mentor that your developer

Mentor uh yeah so one of my good buddies and I met him right when I got into real estate we've always stayed in touch okay

he does his own projects and and he does his own projects but he his his day job

is uh he lends hard money and I remember one day he mentioned he's like hey I got

this this this guy that I'm really good friends with he he's a builder and he

builds really fast and his his prices are affordable and I'm like huh well I'm trying to find that I'm like can you

like put us together and he's like no he he would never he would never meet with you and I'm like okay well and I just

kept bugging him and bugging them and eventually he agreed we met up at a coffee shop and you know I told him what

we do and kind of got to understand what he did at that time he didn't really I

mean he he doesn't he's not like out to like Mentor people but yeah I think he saw something in me where where I had

long-term potential because his vision is eventually leaving the company to his

uh his son and he wants to groom younger guys to have that knowledge kind of like

transfer knowledge of what's his what's in his head and and put it put it into my head and do deals with this sun when

once that time comes so you know we laid out like hey this is how we're going to work together you know be you go shift

your your acquisition strategy to go find these parcels and either you know

we'll just sell the land as is if it's a great deal or we could entitle it and flip it to a big Builder or if you want

to build it then this is how this is how that Arrangement would work and I'm like

done let's do it and we hit the ground running and we have three projects right

now and you know I'm looking for more land but dude in Phoenix it's just so

freaking tough like you know you got to be really Savvy in this market you'd

figure like land right like who's looking at land but Arizona's Arizona we

need we need housing we got all the big Builders here and like Builders brokers

investors like me they're all calling the same people over and over it's no

longer just the Brokers calling to buy land and and give it to one of their clients everybody everybody in the

equation they are calling calling calling calling so it's tough to get a

deal here right now because these sellers have so many different options a lot of competition and everybody's

looking for the same thing especially where there's high density options and not a lot of land availability

M do you see land moving out in the outskirts right now pretty

heavily yeah it is it for sure is that that's the only

option right now the only option yeah exactly because these these Builders they're not going to do like a a

fourouse project DR Horton and KB Holmes and those guys like they I mean they need

hundreds tracks for hundreds of homes the only option the only land that's big

enough to do that is the outskirts but for somebody like me we're more Boutique

which is why we haven't really had success getting more Parcels because we want to be in the city in good locations

and that land is just not available so but you being smaller

you're more Nimble and you can operate lot smaller areas no these these big developers are definitely looking for

like 100 plus homes opportunities and anything smaller than that they're just not looking at it because and this is

one of the things I I recently and not that I didn't know it just kind of like realizations hit you now that you're

doing the space a lot more is that Builder sole business is building so if they don't have inventory to build

they're not making any money yep if you think about it that way absolutely right because like us we can

we can always wholesale we can do a bunch of stuff we have a lot of different exits and creative stuff and we can we can make money a lot of

different ways but builders that have big Crews and big money and they're

publicly traded they can only build only build they have to build I mean yeah you

could you could throttle back the number of starts depending on the economy but

they can ever go to zero starts yeah absolutely absolutely so how long have

you been in like the development side you like so 10 years in real estate like when did that transition happen to go

from like wholesaling to development bit I want to say it was like probably late

19 early 20 okay is kind of when we h no actually I think it was like

2020 because like we were we were scaling our

portfolio and you know we got to a large enough size where we're were like okay this is starting starting to become

inefficient when I say portfolio it's a single family housing portfolio yeah and

I like and and I love single F I mean I get you know people don't like single family and you know go bigger go multif

family but the the tenant profile of single family homes like you can't beat

it like there's no headaches at all like to I think we have about 70 we own 70 units

70 homes that we own personally and not a peep we we manage one apartment

building for our buddies and it's just a freaking pain in the ass so love single family homes I love the build for rent

model because you know it's you're you're taking a single family or town home product and

you're just making it super dense so you get you know the same demographic of a

single family tenants but you get the you get those multif family type efficiencies because they're all crammed

up in one spot so I like that model so I've been I think yeah 2020 is when we

really said okay let's let's start let's start going down the development path I've never thought about it that

way as far as the condos because yeah it you get Best of Both Worlds you get the best of both worlds

and the key is like these units need to have some sort of private space backyards or front yards because

Apartments none of those exist yeah so you want to take kind of like a like a

smaller version of a single family home but they all have to have garages yards but just like you know make the site

plan super dense and put some amenities in there because that's what people want right so yeah you get the because if you

look at this is actually interesting if you look across all real estate asset classes and there's actually a Harvard

study put out like three or four years ago with regards to the volatility of

rents across all the different asset classes okay single family homes is the

least volatile by like 200 200% and

that's across Apartments even commercial office Industrial

retail like it's the stickiest and the most stable income that you could have

across all all asset classes but it's very inefficient income because you have all these scattered homes you know

pretty much so it's a maintenance it's a maintenance and a management nightmare but if you put them all in one spot that's how that's how you create

Alpha efficiencies shared roofs shared roofs yeah you kind of

combine you do shared piping do what Shir piping no no they're all individual

they're all metered for electric and and sewer and water individual individually okay that makes sense so

they they turn on on their own once they occupy the unit ah okay okay now what

amenities are you adding to them to make it more friendly than apartments and

housing and all that stuff you know the big ones are are dog parks so obviously

you know you have to have a pool a pool area even though like nobody ever uses

the pools and then dog dog parks is huge another statistic is renters that have

pets is substancially increases year over year over year so having a place

for them to go walk their dog without leaving the community is extremely important those are those are the big

ones are you gating these at all to kind of provide security uh two of two of the three are going to

be gated okay I think that would that would provide I mean especially the little

pocket pocket Community with with their own little dog park they probably want to protect their dog park you

know exactly but yeah it's you know we're finding a lot of you know just

because you know younger you know Millennials it's home ownership is just

becoming increasingly unobtainable so we're getting a lot of Millennials that come in and then oddly enough I was

actually talking I was golfing with an analyst from a big buil one of the one

of the first buildt for rent developers here in Arizona it's Christopher Todd communities they build

3400 home rental communities at a time like tons of them and you know I was

golfing with them like okay like what's your demographic like in these things and they said surprisingly a lot of

retirees a lot of retirees who want that lock and leave they you know maybe they

they sold their home or want to be closer to their kids and but they don't want to buy anything they just want maintenance free uh maintenance free

living so it's like a mix between retirees and and younger folks that's

interesting that that's interesting alone because I mean I get I get that part 100% you don't want to be cutting

the grass no years 70 years old we cut in the

grass yeah that's cool man there's like legislation coming down the line about

um the these large corporations owning a lot of these homes do you feel it's going to affect you or maybe those

larger corporations maybe not you because you're not as big as them and this is one of the things you're inable

but how do you feel like that if legislation comes on the line where they they start liquidating these build the rent models I don't I honestly I don't

think that would pass and the fact is these large institutions contrary to

what you know mainstream think they actually provide higher quality

homes with better management by far because if you look at if you look at the pie of of rental homes institutions

only own I think the I think right now it's like six% of the total rental stock

in the United States so 90 what whatever that is

94% is still owned by Mom and Pops and Mom and Pops are notorious for deferred

maintenance not piing up the phone not taking care of their assets slum Lord slum slum Lords and I actually think

institutions coming into the rental space is a good thing because they have standards they're put under the

microscope obviously because they're traded on Wall Street they provide higher way higher quality homes than Mom

and Pops interesting and they're improving the communities as well like there's a

lot of Education that had to take place with the city and Planning and Zoning

because when somebody says hey we're going to go build 300 rental units in the middle of a neighborhood like that

nobody understood back then so there was a lot of education and showing like hey

look we're an institutionalized well capitalized landlord and this community is actually

we're going to manage this and take care of this way better than the next guy and it's actually going to make improvements

to your communities no that's huge that's huge

what had a good I had a good one for you too because and also like I guess you

know not to not to beat a dead horse like these institutions their qualification process

is rigorous because a big thing with neighbors and you know app planning and

meetings where neighbors would show up and be like I don't want rent all these rental homes because like they're so used to SL yeah yeah like Mom and Pop

like John and Mary you know anybody who had a who could pay rent they would let them in and they never qualified them

but these institutions they qualify these tenants I mean it's it it's tight so

you're getting a a super high quality tenant not not something and I've rented to somebody you know who you know we

kind of let ones Slide by big mistake I understand what people mean when when by

definition of Slum Lord like these institutions are not slum Lords yeah I just remember my question now so I I I

just talked to a maxi Family Guy and I've seen it in another place but have you heard anything about like celling

utilities like internet and cable back to if you have multiple units yep

y have you started institutionally any any of that since you're in that model almost even though you're Boutique um

you could there's laws around markeing up utilities however you could mark up

internet I think it is yeah it's internet and cable and that's

information this is why this is why it's good so the utility if anybody does that

with the community is managed by the HOA which increases HOA fees to the owner

but if it's owned by a built to rent Community it's kind of self-managed and kind of managed that way but if they

ever liquidate it the HOA takes over that responsibility of managing the internet so so it works for apartments

because there could only be one owner on an apartment building yeah but if you have a built for rent Community there's

always the option of breaking those homes up and selling off individually yeah so unless you plan on

and it depends on how you plat plat the sites right if you're platting them as fee simple Lots like I wouldn't do it

but if you're doing one if you're platting it as a as a multif family project technically even though it's a

build for rent Community I think it does make sense because you know there's

always going to be just one owner you know and yeah like it like to manage or

to to maintain that you know that cable system you're writing annual service

contracts only one person could service it and they're I mean they're not

cheap but but if if you're you know if it's platted as one site or one you know

only one owner could own it it could make sense because again you get an noi

boost I have not seen a a single family community platted as one lot as

multif family I have not it's it doesn't look like when you're when you're doing

like a detached product as a build forent community yeah it it doesn't look like a traditional 45 by 100 foot lot it

look it looks like more cluster product yeah it's a bunch of little units that are laid out in such a way where it

actually feels good but yeah out here in Arizona I mean we were the Pioneers just like everything else in Arizona you know

you know we had for Todd and we had next Metro doing this model back in

2015 and you know everyone is like what like what are you guys doing why not build Apartments but I mean the model

worked and they made freaking a ton of money but yeah it's it's interesting to

see so I did not know that they P pioneered in in Phoenix this is one of

the things where I think it's really cool like you got to pay like if you're very local in your Market you got to pay attention to other markets because you

stuff will adopt into up and cominging markets WR the same thing so I think if you're looking to do cool stuff look at

Phoenix because Phoenix is ahead of the curve in a lot of different ways and if they were doing back in 2015 that's

crazy almost 10 years ago yeah they were the two big ones that's all they did and

then they started like four years ago going into other markets and then the model proved to be so great that the

large single family institutions like American homes for rent progress residential they actually created build

for rent divisions within those within those companies to literally go out buy

lands plat it as single family detached and build it and put it in the

portfolio so now you have like these large reats um emulating the same model as a

way to scale their portfolio wow as a developer that is insane that's actually

pretty cool that's interesting I I love how real estate it's it's very creative like a lot of people they get they get

super creative and they create new architecture or new ideas and then if it

if it sticks it sticks but it's just very creative 100% I think we're gonna end it here man what is what is a quote

that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with I like slow Feet Don't

e slow Feet Don't e which means you got to be freaking on it or you're going to

lose the deal yeah you're just Lolly gagging around you're not getting that deal absolutely got to be on your toes

got to be on your toes stuff will slip through your fingers if you're you're not on it for sure especially in real

estate and I actually heard that one from Donnie ruffen like a couple years ago I'm like that's good I like that

one all right so we can people find you online I know uh you're on Twitter and we have Equity connect.com what else we

got yeah find me on Twitter and I think my handle is one sec here pull it

up I think it's just your name yeah just Jared vid Dallas my first and last name

and the same with Instagram ah there you go there you go

Jared vidales go check him out Equity connect.com I'm excited I I think I

think Phoenix is if you Haven not been to Phoenix please go to Phoenix at least one time in your life I love going to Phoenix but definitely check it out you

can definitely see you can almost see like the future of what of what things like and I I think you can see that

whenever you travel outside the states but I think I've traveled a lot and Phoenix is definitely one of those places it's just a newer newer town like

I said you can always go to the old cities and see like the transition but I think Phoenix is one of those where you kind of see a newer city create new

product and I think it's interesting to see so definitely go check out Phoenix go check out Jared for everybody here go

like share subscribe thanks for coming on the show we appreciate your time and everybody have a great day awesome man

thank you [Applause]

Ep 499: Developement In Phoenix With Jared Vidales

Daniel Esteban Martinez

Jared Vidales